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Filtering Crash, watch your speed

Discussion in 'Main Forum' started by T.C, Oct 20, 2011.

  1. Miky_G

    Miky_G World Superbike +

    Messages:
    782
    Ah, the French flag !
     
    Sporty1200 likes this.
  2. Les

    Les British Superbike +

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    2,559
    I knew you were going to say that.;)
     
  3. R1 Chickie

    R1 Chickie Guest

    I completely disagree, its the fact that motorcycles being the more vulnerable road user do constantly hang back and allow people turning to cross our path that has creates the idea that we have a tacit acceptance that we must give them right of way. If every biker sounded the crap out their horn to say "Im coming through" and carried on at the speed limit doing a filter, it would change this culture/behaviour. The more we dont assert ourselves, the more car drivers just take over. you see it on bus lanes all the time, people turn and everyone comes to a halt to let them when it should be the other way around!
     
  4. Spin

    Spin Street Fighter +

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    193
    Who said anything about not being assertive, and hanging back?

    The whole point of increasing your awareness of hazards (as I said to you on the bends course) is that if you know where you MUST slow down, you can go quicker in the other places because you know there's not so much risk. At 25 (which isn't a SLOW filtering speed at all, in stationary or near stationary traffic!) you can stop in three bike lengths... that's hardly "hanging back"!!

    Safe filtering is about being able to stop when something goes wrong - and that's all about knowing where the risks are and spotting them - and being READY to do something if it turns out to be necessary.
     
    Jim likes this.
  5. R1 Chickie

    R1 Chickie Guest

    You said " so it's no big deal to hang back, check if anything's pulling out and if it is, to wait. It costs you a few seconds." and I was speed reading the first line of the thread and assumed the rest :)
     
    Jim likes this.
  6. Carnage

    Carnage Race Rep +

    Messages:
    775
    at the end of the day a filtering bike is always going to be behind the vehicle in front and it is the riders responsibility to ride within the limits of safety ....sure we are allowed to filter/overtake but do so at our own risk in the knowing that at any second your going to have a lane changer /turner on your hands, as the more progressive vehicle its your duty to anticipate this i.e ...that right turn ahead is an ideal place for a turner .....that guy just looked in his mirror but isnt indicating ...is he about to change lane, was he looking for me or the gap between the cars in the next lane .....at the end of the day he/she is only trying to get from a to b as quickly as possible the same as us .....we just chose the quicker option of 2 wheels.
    if your alongside a car in traffic and they turn into you ....not a lot you can do about it ...you put yourself there no one forced you....if your approaching a car and they turn in and you hit them then you shouldnt be going that fast through traffic. we know how ignorant people who only drive cars can be to motorcyclists we just need to deal with it and treat them with the contempt they deserve ....as idiots.
     
    Jim and Les like this.
  7. Les

    Les British Superbike +

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    2,559
    Can't be arsed to get too involved in these topics but I reckon Carnage has it about right. Other than it can also happen at the beginning of the day.:p
     
    viking killer likes this.
  8. Spin

    Spin Street Fighter +

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    193
    I like that post...

    Right up to that bit.

    How many of you lot were car drivers BEFORE you learned to ride a bike? I'd hazard a guess it's a significant proportion. Did learning to ride a bike suddenly convert you from being an "idiot" to whatever the opposite of idiot is? I doubt it.

    What it did was teach you a new set of skills for using a very different kind of vehicle.

    There ARE a few very poor drivers around... and there ARE a few homicidal maniacs on four wheels too. The same can be said for bikers as it happens. But the vast majority of drivers are simply getting on with driving doing the best they can. It may not be a very good best... but that's life in general.
     
    _Yappa_ likes this.
  9. Jim

    Jim Race Rep +

    Messages:
    661
    Have to agree that there are certainly some homicidal bikers about who don't do anything to help our arguments sometimes, but that's the nature of the beast I suppose (I was one once:sneaky:)
     
  10. Roadwart

    Roadwart Administrator Staff Member Administrator +

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    6,721
    A few poor drivers? On my way to & from work MOST are, imo, not even as good as poor! Non indication, whichever direction they are going seems to be the main thing. I`m assuming there`s new telepathic indicators fitted to cars that I don`t seem to be able to find anywhere. Those that do use them, the majority do it at the last moment or once they have already started the turn. Indicators are to show a road users *intention* to turn, not *I AM turning* as they seem to used for these days.

    I don`t profess to be a driving or riding expert, far from it but I have the courtesy to show others what I am planning on doing so they can plan ahead. I just wish they would do the same.

    For those who may be interested, there is a program on C5 8pm Weds "Dangerous drivers school" which started last week. 1 chap was told by the professional "I don`t believe you even have a full license" he was that bad.
     
  11. Spin

    Spin Street Fighter +

    Messages:
    193
    'Scuse me for being picky but I said "a few VERY poor drivers"... subtle difference. I agree there is a lot of poor driving around, but on the other hand nothing you've mentioned is really any different to what it was 35 years ago when I started riding.

    What HAS changed is that there are far MORE cars on the road, driving far more miles, so the roads are infinitely more crowded... more people are in a hurry... and more people lose their rag with each other far more often... drivers with each other, drivers with bikers... and bikers with drivers.

    But if we're going to treat someone else with courtesy and consideration (and thus hope that what goes round, comes round) then a good place to start is by NOT thinking they're idiots and thinking that allows you to treat them with contempt, and to accept that like us, they make mistakes and do quite a few things that aren't as good as they could be.
     
  12. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator +

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    7,985
    there aren't that many more bad drivers than there are bad riders just the percentage of drivers means we encounter more. It's funny how we will only remember the bad drivers, i guess it;s that the good ones just don't pose a problem so there are in your mirrors straight away :thumbsup:

    i have a vaugue memory of one very good driver that had they not done some pretty good driving with quick reactions then maybe just maybe i would have hit them so i can't tar them all with the same brush ( except to say that driver clearly had a bike in their garage :hah: )
     
  13. Kevin Taylor

    Kevin Taylor Off Roader +

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    284
    Another thing to throw into the current mix is the influx of foreign drivers. I know for a fact that many of these are indeed driving cars having never had any instruction. The problem with a lot of eastern european registered vehicles is the police are not too interested a lot of the time. Nicking these drivers appears to be a bit too much hassle. For info our car park at work has loads of Lithuanian, Latvian, Polish and other foreign regsistered cars.
     
  14. megawatt

    megawatt World Superbike +

    Messages:
    5,039
    Another difference between bad drivers and bad riders is it's almost always the rider that comes off worst. A collision in a car is just an inconvenience and a bit more grief with insurance. A collision on a bike is life threatening, often injurious and at least damaging to the rider and bike. Car drivers don't worry that what they do could injure them, they don't even worry that it could injure someone else, they just do it, usually with hardly a glance. I'm sick of all the publicity directed at riders, it's the car drivers that could do with some more educating! In my humble opinion:)
     
    R1 Chickie likes this.
  15. R1 Chickie

    R1 Chickie Guest

    Oh, Im sorry, I didnt realise full retirement was so taxing :D
     
  16. R1 Chickie

    R1 Chickie Guest

    Its thanks to the good drivers we are still having this conversation :)
     
  17. Les

    Les British Superbike +

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    2,559
    Talking of taxing, just you keep paying in ;). PS, How was rafting?
     
  18. Roadwart

    Roadwart Administrator Staff Member Administrator +

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    6,721
    I agree with that, the more vehicles there are, the more chance you have of running into a situation & people in a hurry is probably the biggest reason for it.

    One of the first things I was told when learning to ride is that "Everyone is NOT out to get you but you will have to think for them sometimes". I`ve always remembered this & I try to take that into account. I appreciate that the roads may not be familiar to everyone & that people do make mistakes sometimes. However, seeing the same mistakes by the same vehicles at 3 separate places within 5 mins is pushing it a bit ;)

    I think you have it there Tom. You do seem to only remember the bad drivers & not the dozens that you also encountered who were more competent.
     
  19. R1 Chickie

    R1 Chickie Guest

  20. Carnage

    Carnage Race Rep +

    Messages:
    775
    ok allow me to retract and re word because i see how what i said about treating car drivers like idiots meant i thought all car drivers are idiots, NOT AT ALL ( incidently ive been riding since i was 16 and didnt start driving till i was 24 ....im now 47) what i should have said was if you ride defensively as if every car driver is an idiot and is liable to do the unexpected then you will have just added in one of the most profficient forms of protection to your arsenal of staying on 2 wheels when filtering..........there ya go ....crack on;)
     
    Rhino likes this.

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