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Answers to some questions posted in the new mod thread

Discussion in 'Site Feedback' started by BlackHornet, Nov 2, 2012.

  1. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    6,991
    firstly let me say that this is posted here to keep these issues out of the members lounge and to allow issues to be resolved without causing anymore fuss in other areas.

    This relates to the issues raised by Sporty and seconded by MadProff. if you have already had enough of that then please don't read any futher. :D

    Madproff's post
    "
    I did not really want to post this, as for me the incident had died and I let it go, although I was not happy at all about it at the time, until a post I saw the other day, and now posts Roadwart has made since, but Sorry I have disagree with you here Roadwart, for one Kevin is not the only one that has a problem with the way the site has been run up to now, I do, even if only in one situation which has got way out of hand. I know a few others were not happy with that outcome, but it is up to them if they come forward.

    This all really stems from Posts being deleted by yourself, and correct me if I am wrong Tom I assume you two discussed it decided that was the course of action you wanted to take, and that I and Kevin posted on one of his threads. as for Kevin's maybe a over sarcastic post different opinions I guess, but mine was a fact that I took from other web sites to prove a point, even though you would rather believe him over me, and not bother to verify the facts first, I felt I was treated rather harsh, and then your post which was aimed at me personally clearly stating that that what ever you say goes, and TC is God. You to this day still think you were right in your actions, even though Tom has held his hand up and sort of agreed TC was not all he seemed to be. Maybe this whole situation would not even be here if a different action had been taken, for one a post after mine stating how you felt, instead of deletion, a pm to me to discuss it, but you felt you had to put in public to try and embarrass some members. I know You have stated that TC deleted some of the posts, but he did not delete my posts.

    So I think some comments and posts are warranted about what the mods and admin in my case has the right to do, It is not a witch hunt, just I want to make sure the situation does not happen again and the people with control do not abuse it. I do feel you Roadwart think it is your Site and what you say goes, maybe I am wrong, I got the impression it was a group thing, but you have posted on several occasions in a round about's way "that if you do not like it, clear off" which I find quite sad when people have contributed, and supported the site with money, where as TC has not, but he is the one you were sticking up for, someone you do not really know much about, someone how really does not add anything else to this site, someone who will never meet us as a group I guess over some people who do.

    I will state again it is not a personal attack at you, or what you have and do do for the site, I for one know who hard it is and work involved and all ready have stated it is appreciated, but for me just what you may do because you do not like something said on this site."

    so allow me to answer this in very simple points.
    Firstly i deleted the first thread. I did this because when i read it it seamed to me that it was a personal attack. well the mod team had already set in place rules governing threads that could be regarded as such and so i deleted it. Now sporty was part of the mod team he time that came up with those guidelines so for someone to be focussing so had on wanting more poilices maybe he should agree that one was followed and let it stop there.

    Your post was deleted not because it was incorrect or correct but purely as you had posted on a much older thread in which you were going to continue the above mentioned thread, which would have only lead to re-opening a can of worms. It's as simple as that.

    We had this happen once before and we did the same thing then. It makes no odds as to who is involved mods and admin have to do our best to try and keep the forum running in a way that the mojority of members like. so in short we followed the same pattern already set out by past experiance at a time when sporty was a mod and he made no objections the first time. We have to follow the same steps in cases like this to keep things fair.

    There have been over 40,000 posts on here and over 2,000 threads the mod team have deleted a total of 2 threads and a handful of posts. Thats 0.1% of threads and even less posts. It effected maybe a total of 4 people on the forum out over over 150. So thats maybe 2.5% of users yet that leaves 97.5 % of users to carry on enjoying the forum. As a mod team we have to think about the majority and do what we see as best. We know we won't always please everyone all the time so instead we aim to please as many as we can as much of the time.

    so you have to ask yourself these simple questions with only yes or no answers.

    1. do you want the mod team to take action when they think things are getting out of hand ?

    2. do you want the mod team to prevent the same things kicking off again and again on different threads and sections on the forum?


    The next point i wish to raise is about this " dictatorship" you seam to think roadwart is trying to run.

    If he was don't you think he would have already closed many of the posts that have been attacks on him ?
    Would he have not already banned members that he didn't agree with ?

    yet he has choosen to leave these posts and allow all members the freedom to post even when they are nothing more than digs at him. If thats what you think a dictator does then you need to visit a few places around the world as your eyes would soon be opened and them maybe cut out :p

    So roady posts " if you don't like it then you are free to leave"

    well yes you are, just as you are currently free to stay, read and post on the forum.

    It's very simple if you want the site to be good then help make it good, mud slinging and bringing up the same things over and over doesn't please most poeple here. In fact just the fact this post has a serious side to it i would bet most people won't even read this far. :D

    If i haven't answered anything let me know in this section and i will try to do my best.
     
    deano81 likes this.
  2. MaDProFF

    MaDProFF British Superbike

    Messages:
    2,186
    Your post was deleted not because it was incorrect or correct but purely as you had posted on a much older thread in which you were going to continue the above mentioned thread, which would have only lead to re-opening a can of worms. It's as simple as that.

    So if this is the cases why was it deleted, I was not to know the history, I saw a thread that had been current, and posted some facts as I saw it, the information TC had posted was incorrect I corrected it, and made a point that he had spammed it on several other forums, If you had pm ed me and explained, or made a comment to "stating the point" fair enough, but no, just a deleted post and then a post from Roadwart which I felt was pointed to me, and quite rude. I think it is closure in my case, most people agree now that TC was given too much benefit of the doubt over some good active members (not myself) on the forum, and now knowing this the earlier actions would not have happened the way they did if the People running the Forum had acted differently, lets face it it has caused a lot of grief over some very quick made decisions of deleting

    I want the mod team:- To be tactful, and give reasons as to why they have acted in the way they have, PM etc, or a post in that thread giving a valid reason, instead of just deleting a post with no reason as to why at first, and hope the problem goes away and then when it doesn't not to post a message to the effect I make the decisions and it is this.

    The Reason things get bought up over and over is because there is not a satisfactory outcome in the first place in my eyes, and some others I guess, I want to make sure it does not happen the way it did to me again.

    The only Reason I feel Roadwart is trying to the run the site as you put it is because of his recent posts and some actions in the past towards me. He may feel he is being targeted, but he is not by me, just he was the one in my case who made the post related to my post. so for me it relates to my issues, but as Admin I think he could have been a little more tactful, My personal view of course :).

    The reason this whole mod elections are taking place as you know is some people were not happy over several things and hence the changes, and some of the reasons was the TC debacle.
     
  3. MaDProFF

    MaDProFF British Superbike

    Messages:
    2,186
    There is one other issue the attitude of "well if you do not like it you can leave" well exactly who does that help? if one active member who has friends leaves, and then a few others follow, before you know it the site falls apart, for me that is the wrong attitude, and ruins it for everyone not to mention all the work that has been put in. There is always a solution if people are treated fairly, and actions explained to the offending party's. I do not want anyone to leave this site or be told to if they are an active member and site supporter. I think this is the wrong approach
     
  4. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    6,991

    so your saying we should force you to stay ? Basically it's freedom. The freedom to choose if you read something, post to something or don't even come online. Basically i would say that if someone dislikes something then they have a choice to either enjoy the rest of the site and forget about that single issue, bring the point up ( at the time is always best ) and hope it can be resolved or not come on. pretty simple.

    "I want the mod team:- To be tactful, and give reasons as to why they have acted in the way they have, PM etc, or a post in that thread giving a valid reason, instead of just deleting a post with no reason as to why at first, and hope the problem goes away and then when it doesn't not to post a message to the effect I make the decisions and it is this."
    did you read the reason as to why your post was deleted? it was stated at the time. maybe it's only shown to mods :rolleyes: i'm honestly not sure about that. With various lifestyles people lead it wouldn't be possible to go around explain prior to acting as posts may stay up for days before a member would have the chance to read and reply and again people could go around in circles. :sleep::sleep::sleep: then think about this if a mod posted up a reason that could again continue something that needs to be closed, what good does that do ? You are always free to ask but remember a mod is here to please the majority not just the few so the answer may again take a day or two.

    "
    The reason this whole mod elections are taking place as you know is some people were not happy over several things and hence the changes, and some of the reasons was the TC debacle. "
    sorry but thats not the reason. the reason is plain and simple. it was decided it was time, after all the elections weren't called by any members on here but by the mods.
     
  5. Sporty1200

    Sporty1200 British Superbike

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    2,064
    I know i raised the issue way back, but Did all the mods consent to the election?
     
  6. ramrider

    ramrider Race Rep

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    773
    it was decided when the forum started that we would change the mods yearly
     
  7. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    6,991
    nope but thats the point of having a team, you only need get the highest number of votes and all those that posted agreed :D

    so your point here being ?
     
  8. Sporty1200

    Sporty1200 British Superbike

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    2,064
    The mod team are hugly depleted, was it a very small majority? :D
     
  9. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

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    6,991
    5 out of 9 :D
    so againwhat point are you trying to make ?
     
  10. Sporty1200

    Sporty1200 British Superbike

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    2,064
    Did 5 out of 9 agree to the elections. Just asking
     
  11. Skortchio

    Skortchio Caustic

    Messages:
    2,035
    The election thread went cold for 3months, it was then ressurected when BH announced the elections would be cast. There was no discussion or vote between mods beyond BH and RW.

    The rest of the team found out when the members did.
     
    GixxerGilly likes this.
  12. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

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    6,991
    you all knew a week before and all those that replied, including you gave it the nod
     
  13. Sporty1200

    Sporty1200 British Superbike

    Messages:
    2,064
    So a majority of 2 out of 9 then? hmmmmm. cmon, that aint good.
     
  14. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    6,991
    nope 5 out of nine. yes it was annouced and a few mods raised questions as you would expect, but all agree ( of the 5 the did post ) that is was time.

    and your point sporty? do you even have one ? because to be honest you need to speak now or forever hold your piece.
    You say you want to improve the forum so how are you going about doing that ? what suggestions have you put forward ? where have you attempted to resolve this issue? have you taken into account any members feelings or even the smooth running of the forum ?
     
  15. Skortchio

    Skortchio Caustic

    Messages:
    2,035
    In fairness, Tom. The post announcing it wasn't an open discussion it was a heads up that it was happening regardless.

    My exact statement was that as no one had bothered replying to the old thread, or the new one then it appears any debate was falling to deaf ears. So to carry on regardless.

    It was more resignation to the fact that the decision was already made rather than wholehearted agreement.
    As it's already been said on the mods forum, the choice had been made when you posted as clearly stated within it. It was at best a courtesy informing the other mods in advance of the members, rather than an opening for discussion on the matter.

    So no, I didn't give it the nod. I accepted it wasn't a matter open to discussion.

    But It's too late to make a hair of difference now and I've got greater concerns currently taking my attention, so I'll bid adieu.

    Ta ta
     
    GixxerGilly likes this.
  16. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    6,991
    ok maybe i took it the wrong way. good luck with the transmission :thumbsup:
     
    Skortchio likes this.
  17. Sporty1200

    Sporty1200 British Superbike

    Messages:
    2,064
    Cmon the above isnt democratic.

    I have suggested several improvements, we have spoken about it and i have posted it too relating too - Policies, procedure and a participatory mod team so there is a real majority not a tiny one. Think i initated the elections way back before i gave up my mod status...
     
  18. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    6,991
    the first post in mod re elections was july by roady at that point all repling mods agreed. the next post was by you and again i think all posting mods agreed and then finally i posted up saying it was happening, as i said a few questions but no one said no and that was 5 mods. so thats 2 votes and another period of notice i think thats pretty democratic.

    To be honest sporty you keep saying you have posted about polocies etc but besides one that i can find you really haven't. yes when a mod you took part in every debate ( pretty sure it was all of them but i'm nbot worried about checking ) but didn't start many. And since stepping down as a mod you sent a message once saying we needed a policies to cover a single point and i replied, showing where most things are already covered.

    To be honest we are bikers we like our freedom what we don't want or need is a million rules we just need people to be chilled and get on with what is really important and thats bikes not posts.
     
    kitten_art and deano81 like this.
  19. lammyR6

    lammyR6 Moderator Staff Member Moderator Site Supporter

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    4,595
    Nothing to do with the debate about mods, just a personal observation. I have just come back from a week away to this. Really depressing to read. If anyone new were to join the site right now and start by reading these posts they would most likely be gone in seconds. :(
    Sounds like people need to talk to eachother in person, take it off the site and lets get back to having banter about bikes, rideouts, muddy biker boots, trackdays and other cheerful things! :) :ghug:
     
  20. BlackHornet

    BlackHornet Look before you turn Staff Member Moderator

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    6,991
    well said Lammy :D :welcome: home :hug3:
     

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